Tuesday, October 1, 2013
LGBTQ in the USA
You can try singing "LGBTQ" in the USA to the song "R-O-C-K in the USA" by Bruce Springsteen, but it doesn't work very well. Anyway, load this blog up with questions and comments, then go away for a while while your colleagues work their magic, then return and, voile!, tons of amazing ideas to respond to.
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The fact that there are more anti-gay crimes in New York and across the nation is alarming, and kind of incredible that the other hate crime rate decreased. Also, I thought it was interesting that in the conclusion, it seems like a Catch-22: the national acceptance of the LGBT community is generally more accepting so perhaps the crime rate has increased because of the acceptance to reporting such crimes OR that people who really hate the LGBT community are reacting violently to their progress because they are progressing so quickly.
ReplyDeleteAlso, it wasn’t just about gays--it was about other hate crimes: “LGBTQ people of color were 1.82 times as likely to experience physical violence compared to White LGBTQ people, and gay men were 1.56 times as likely to require medical attention compared to other survivors reporting”
Rachel, I thought that was very alarming too. Unfortunately, hate and violence stem from a lack of understanding, and I think we will work towards that in our classrooms!
DeleteI agree Chelsea! If there was a way to teach kids that they can't hate what they are afraid of or don't know, then that would help the situation a lot. At the same time, they are encouraged to exercise their "free speech" and opinions in class discussions, but to me, some of it is just completely morally wrong.
DeleteWhat will you do if you hear someone gay-bashing in your school (like in the hall way) or in your class?
ReplyDeleteAwww hell naw! I don't take that crap from kids. I've gotten onto them for gay slurs before. It's discrimination and I wouldn't take it if it was referring to race, so why should it be okay if it was referring to being gay? Nope. Not okay.
DeleteThis already happened to me when I was at Baldwin. A table of boys were talking about another guy at the school that is gay and making fun of him and then they started calling each other gay just to piss each other off. I walked over and asked what they were talking about and they all said "Nothing." I said, "Thats what I thought. You guys shouldn't talk about people like that. Its mean and offensive and really hurts people." They all apologized but I don't think they really listened to me...
DeleteI won't take it, just as I won't take any sexist or racist slurs in my classroom. I think that's gonna be one of the things that makes me go off; it's just important to remember that slurs and demeaning comments come from ignorance, and to take the opportunity as a teaching lesson.
DeleteAny kind of bullying, discrimination, hate, etc. is not acceptable in my classroom. I remember when I was teased for being the only kid with slanted eyes in kindergarten. It's traumatizing, especially if the teacher doesn't do anything about it, regardless the gender, race, sexual orientation. I want my students to come to my classroom knowing it's a safe environment & that I will not tolerate students making fun of or bashing others for being different. We're all different. So, to answer your question Rachel, I will definitely enforce rules about name calling, teasing, bullying, etc. I will not just let it go. I think I would pull those kids that are "gay-bashing" out in the hall & ask them why they would do that. Then, I would give them choices of some form of consequence for their action(s). Then, I would make them sincerely apologize to the student they were saying things about.
DeleteI like your plan of action, Jessica. I agree whole-heartedly.
DeleteIt's bullying. I don't cotton to it and if I catch on, would put a stop to it and any other forms of bullying. It has no place. Period.
DeleteI agree with all of the above! Good job guys, these were the answers I was looking for.
DeleteOmg that better not happen in my classroom! they will have to deal with my wrath if that occurs... but on a more serious note, I would take the student making the comments out of my classroom and have a discussion with them about what they were saying and why... and explain to them why they can not say such things
DeleteI never realized how many benefits that heterosexual people receive that LGBTQ people don't. It is disturbing, to say the least, that because these people have love for one type of person rather than another, they miss out on privileges we all have a right to by living in America. I think this issue should be at the forefront of the movement, considering how much of an impact it has on the lives of those involved.
ReplyDeleteMost people don't realize how many rights they don't receive due to their sexuality... It really is quite awful. I was already pretty aware of this because ive watched videos and documentaries on it... but it never becomes any less upsetting to hear about
DeleteWill you discuss LGBTQ issues in your classroom? Is it something you will bring up or wait out to see if someone else does and address it then?
ReplyDeleteHonestly, I think it will be an issue I would address whenever a problem arises. If my students want to learn more about the issues surrounding it, or have personal questions on the subject, then I think I could take some class time to discuss LGBTQ matters.
DeleteLGBTQ issues be a topic that comes up in the classroom whenever their is any bullying happening in the school or classroom for such reasons or whenever their is something about it in the news or media. I feel like it is a relevant topic for today's students because the issues are in the news and internet so much that addressing them in the classroom won't seem completely out of the blue or out of context.
DeleteI agree with Jenni and Leslie. I'd address it if I feel it's relevant to a situation, but I wouldn't necessarily do so in a regular lesson, as basically I just don't want to field calls from parents... :P
DeleteHowever, I do think I would show some artists who are LGBTQ and if the students find more about them on their own, great. I'd think the art itself and how it pertains to the lesson would be my blatant reason for choosing artists and the diversity would almost be subversive, not pointed out (race, gender, sexual orientation, etc.), but there, if that makes sense.
I like your approach, Noel! I think incorporating artists who happen to be LGBTQ into your lessons is a good way to approach it. Their sexual orientation may not define their art but it is good to have a broad representation of people in your examples, just like you want to have examples from artists of different races. Maybe by putting these diverse examples in without having to blatantly point it out will start gearing student's minds towards seeing people for what they are passionate about (ART YAY :)) not for how they were born.
DeleteIn my placement now, there are a lot of gay kids (out and in) that need an outlet. Because the students are building such a good community, it is a safe place for the gay students--we have not had a discussion about it specifically, but all the students feel safe. One in praticular is obsessed with One Direction, so I put a slide about One Direction in my lesson and it was the first time that student ever spoke up in class while I was there. He knew the answer to all the questions after that. I think it is so important for them to feel comfortable, as well as incorporate lessons that include authors that are of different perspectives.
DeleteOne aspect of the module that really disturbed me is that married couples receive 1,138 rights, benefits, and protections while those who may be in a same-sex committed relationship do not receive any such federal or state provisions. This shows that our nation still views the LGBTQ community as being second class citizens. When the government does not provide equal rights and privileges to all, then it is basically communicating the idea that there are certain degrees of citizenship based on arbitrary criteria. Gah, I don’t like that one bit.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing I found interesting is the article that addressed the threat of being “out” in the workplace. The fact that only 16 states protect gay and lesbian employees from getting fired based on their sexual orientation is quite disappointing. Although much of the national discourse and policy-making has been centered on the issue of Gay Marriage, the issue of discrimination based on sexual orientation in the workplace seems to be pertinent and deserves media attention and legislative action as well. Why the push for Gay Marriage but not for equal rights in the workplace? Don’t get me wrong here, I fully support Gay Marriage (or, marriage in general really), but if employees are so fixed on not coming out in the workplace then wouldn’t they feel as if their jobs would be threatened if they did get married? Also, what does this mean for teachers?
For me, I'm more than willing to get fired for being gay. If you don't want me there because of who I sleep with, then you don't deserve to have me teaching at your school. BUT, I'm young and head-strong. Not everyone else is that way or can afford to change jobs in this economy.
DeleteMy question is similar to Sabrina's. How will LGBTQ issues be brought up in the classroom? Is it easier to begin talking about these issues on a national scale and then progress into the more immediate, school environment?
ReplyDeleteThis one is just for curiosity's sake: Do you think it will be easier to talk about race issues or LGBTQ issues in the classroom? There was so much information on how race is difficult for us to address. Does discourse surrounding the LGBTQ community possess the same apprehension? Why, or why not?
For me personally, I feel much more comfortable talking about issues of race in the classroom. It's similar to Cynthia's experience where she and the black teacher were teaching the same material and students felt that the black teacher was "pushing an agenda." I don't intend to shy away from discussing LGBT issues, but only through literature.
DeleteI would feel more comfortable talking about race as there's still a stigma regarding LGBTQ and rights, especially since schools can be very conservative to avoid litigation and such from angry parents. Doesn't mean I wouldn't do it, but I would have to ponder options and reasons carefully depending on the situation.
DeleteI thought it was an incredibly valid point that was made in the employment article, that although same sex marriage is making leaps and bounds, the fact that their employment rights aren't protected still causes many people to lie to employees and coworkers. Its a ridiculous idea that anyone should be put in the position to be able to get married but maybe loose their job because of it. Who you choose to love should not affect your employment status.
ReplyDeleteThis is a kind of random and probably slightly out there question, but do you guys think there is a reason that 57% of the hate crimes reported against the LGBTQ community were men? Or do you think that because it is so close to being half and half, it doesn't really matter?
I agree with Sabrina. taking into account a traditional definition of sexuality in a patriarchal, puritanical society where men “determine when girls are ripe for penetrating and who can or should have the authority to do the penetrating” (Theodora Jankowski), it's a threat to masculinity for gay men to have gay sex. The reason for violence against LGBTQ etc peoples, in my opinion, is that their sexual behavior is seen as the whole of their existence. We're not people first, we're our bedroom behavior first. That's why so many parents have trouble accepting a gay child- THe parents don't see anything else but "sexual deviant behavior."
DeleteKind of a rambling post, sorry.
^^ Yes to all of this JoJo. I believe that as a society (and as a planet, but we'll get there) we should see a human being first, not a sexual orientation.
DeleteThe article about the employment was disturbing. Many places I'd worked did have a very homophobic environment. Some of them were the stereotypical factory or demolition jobs, but it was also prevalent in retail and the government job I had. Even if someone didn't lose their job over homophobic reactions, the other employees generally had a 'less-than favorable' perception of homosexuality, but as cited in the article, oftentimes the homosexual is the one cited as 'creating a hostile work environment' just by existing. :P
ReplyDeleteHere's my question: If a student comes out to you privately, what would you say to them? How would you offer support to them in a way that respects their privacy? What if their homosexuality is tied in with suicidal thoughts, as homosexuals have a much higher rate of depression and suicide? Would you try and find a way that calls attention to the potential of suicide while still trying to maintain their privacy, or would you simply argue that the danger outweighs any privacy issues?
ReplyDeleteWhen dealing with a student coming out to us, I think I would just let them know that I support them and that I will help them as much as I can to make their life just as easy as anyone else's. I think it is important to give the students a place to talk, a place to vent, or a place to figure themselves out... just like straight kids get to do. When it comes to suicidal thoughts, I think that is where I draw the line of getting external help. I couldn't bare the thought of trying to fix the issue by myself, without the help of a professional, and failing to help the child. I think privacy is important, and I may even leave out the fact that the student is LGBTQ when explaining to the counselor, professional psychiatrist,etc., but I think that when a student tells you something that lets you know they may be in danger, you must tell someone.
DeleteI have had an oddly large number of students come out to me over the years. What I quickly discovered was how every case was so different, and what seemed appropriate in each case was very different. Hopefully I can get Dr. Power to conduct "SafeSpace" training for those of you who would like it. That training focuses heavily on how to create a safe space for LGBTQ students and how to handle issues such as students coming out to you.
DeleteI am shocked by the NYTimes article, where Jake spends his lunch breaks in his car to avoid possibly revealing that he is gay. I can't imagine having to hide your relationship of 12 years because people are so ignorant and judgmental. When we talked about this topic on Tuesday, I was also surprised by the fact that lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender people can be fired for their orientation, and that there is no law to protect them from this. It's just hard to believe that this is 2013 and we're still having these issues.
ReplyDeleteIt's very sad, especially since someone could be happily out at the workplace, then a new regime comes in and decides to have a problem with the employee's sexual orientation all of a sudden (as mentioned in the article). Very disturbing. All it takes is some bigoted person to gain power and if they're determined enough, they can do quite a bit of things to get someone fired. Some of those people who rise to middle management can be very vicious, as they aren't high-ranking yet, but seeking to make that extra climb by any means necessary. Not all, of course, but many. Also, let's not forget, the employee doesn't even have to be LGBTQ, they just have to be *perceived* as such, which should scare anyone.
DeleteI'm not sure how to go about discussing the LGBTQ issue in a classroom. What are some of your ideas? Are there any books you know of that have a character who is gay? How do we talk about this and make sure everyone is comfortable, like making sure that the "Christian" view isn't brought into discussion?
ReplyDeleteI would also like to know of a book with a gay protagonist. That would be a great way of incorporating the topic into class discussion.
DeleteI looked it up and this website caught my attention. It has brief synopses of 25 YA books with LGBT themes:
Deletehttp://www.epicreads.com/blog/25-must-read-ya-books-featuring-gay-protagonists/
And, Kaitlin, How do you (or all of us as educators) also respect the beliefs of your Christian students, or Muslim, etc who don't believe that homosexual behavior is moral? How can the morality discussion be left out all together? Because it's very possible that you'll find a class where the majority supports and affirms the gay student but attacks the christian student for backwards beliefs. hooray for double edged swords!
DeleteThanks Jenni! Jojo, I don't doubt that those kinds of situations will come up. Right now I'm not sure how to keep morality out of the classroom. I don't want to tell a student that what he/she believes or feels is wrong, no matter the topic. I'm glad we're discussing these topics in class because I'm learning so many different ways to talk about things that may make some people uncomfortable. And for real, hooray for those swords. =/
DeleteThe NY Times article that highlighted the man that had to eat lunch IN HIS CAR about broke my heart. :/ That is so sad. The fact that he doesn't want to accidentally bring up his partner in conversation due to the risk of losing his job gave me a new perspective on what LGBT people go through on a daily basis. That's just added stress. I had never thought about how fearful LGBT people may feel at work due to them not wanting to disclose this information; at the end of the day, it could mean being employed versus being unemployed. I think it's quite alarming that someone could get fired just for being LGBT. Just because someone is LGBT does not necessarily mean that they will create a "hostile environment." People need to be more accepting of others, regardless of gender, race, SES, sexual orientation, etc.
ReplyDeleteHowever, we can all be kind to one another & make the world a better place. =P
I was thinking the same thing, Jess! How stressful that must be for them to live with everyday. I get stressed out about normal, daily life. I cannot imagine trying to keep that huge of a secret about myself with people I see for the majority of my day.
DeleteI hope this makes sense...This is on topic, but not specifically from the readings.
ReplyDeleteA few weeks ago I was talking to my old roommate. (She's a second year teacher.) She told me that she has an overnight school function coming up & that she has to be mindful of not putting certain boys together & not putting certain girls together concerning rooming situations (genders are separated of course). She said that a couple of her LGBT/LGBTQ students have came to her about not being roomed with those that are not accepting of their sexual orientation. This creates a stressful situation for LGBTQ students, I'm sure. She said there are a lot of things to consider when assigning rooms, groups, etc. (more than I realized prior to our conversation).
So my questions is -- have y'all ever thought about all this? I don't know how often students are allowed to go on overnight trips, however, should this occur it would be nice to know your thoughts/suggestions/comments.
That is really interesting. I have never really thought about it. It also makes me wonder who you would room together. Obviously you wouldn't want to make the LGBT students uncomfortable by rooming them with those who don't understand or approve, but at the same time, you also don't want to room them together for the same reason you separate boys and girls. Perhaps find a group of accepting, open-minded people and group the LGBT students with them?
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DeleteAlso one more question, what are some of your school's policies right now concerning LGBT issues? Have any of your host teachers had to address this topic in class?
ReplyDeleteIt just so happens that this subject was brought up in my placement this week & my host teacher handled it with care! Dr. Alby, I will try to remember to share this with you at my meeting next week. It's a good story!
That's an interesting question because I have no clue! My teacher hasn't brought it up so I need to ask someone about that. Any Jones folks know the answer? I'm so curious now...
DeleteCan you share it with me too Jess? I'm a person vigilant about any bulling or pre-bulling, and simply say something like "talking like that and behaving like that is unacceptable in my classroom."
DeleteI've heard other teachers say: "Gay should never be used as an insult to someone. I'm happy today, so I'm just as gay as I can be." etc.
That is an excellent question! It hasn't been brought up in my class either, and to add another question onto this one, if your school doesn't have an outright policy...how do you handle LGBT issues without getting in trouble with parents?
DeleteAbsolutely, JoJo. It's not one where he had to discipline a student, but rather drove home that we should all be kind to one another. :) Indeed, we should. I walked away being like, "wow, he handled that well." haha.
DeleteI would be very interested to know what some of you answered for question one about the epigenetics. It is in an interesting way to word the question, "so that your grandmother would understand." I found myself wondering how I would actually explain this to my grandmother and convince her that it's not made up. She and many other people from her generation would most likely refuse to believe these studies are true because of the way they were raised and the way their generation typically views homosexuality. So that is my question, how would you approach this topic to someone from that generation?
ReplyDeleteI found myself thinking the same thing. My grandmother is a very strong-minded person, but she believes in science. So, I explained in my module that I would tell my grandmother that it has been proven through science that there is something in the chromosomal expression that makes a person LGBTQ.
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DeleteHonestly, I wouldn't explain it. I'm through wasting time trying to "prove" to anyone that sexuality isn't a choice. Let strong willed elderly people believe whatever they want to, and let them go to their grave convinced it's a choice. It's not going to change the fact that society is slowly changing as a whole. Focus more on spreading the word to the baby-boomers and younger about the new scientific findings. And really, everyone is entitled to their own thoughts just as along as no one's freedoms are being taken away.
DeleteI'll be honest, that article was confusing to me. However, I think it's simply environment affects genetics in the womb and through those changes affects the offspring's eventual offspring.
DeleteIf I'm wrong, please let me know and I'll just sit and watch cartoons. :P
My comment is about how LGBTQ people are treated in the workplace. I think it is totally unfair that a person can be fired from their job because of their sexual orientation. I'm not saying that everyone has to be comfortable with another persons choices but it's none of their business and it isn't going to effect them or their work. The fact that someone would have to actively hide their personal life from the people they work with in order to keep their job is unfair and it should be legally addressed.
ReplyDeleteOn the whole fairness of this, I agree with you, Emily. And even if a law does get passed to protect the LGBTQ people, think of all of the tension it will create for those who are opposing it. They could end up treating the LGBTQ people really mean or make their life miserable in hopes that the LGBT person would eventually quit. Think about all that stress even if they were protected by law. Mean people are still mean. Aww...that makes me feel sad. :( But, yes there should be some protection for the LGBTQ community in regards to your comment above. No one should lose their job based on sexual orientation.
DeleteIt was interesting reading about the science behind homosexuality, especially the epigenetics. I have often wondered about the question the article posed about a trait that prevents child bearing. Near the bottom of the article it talked about the controversy of the study. Ultimately, I need to teach students, because they deserve a good education. If the byproduct is what I want, even better! We have a great responsibility to our students and we need to take it seriously.
ReplyDeleteQuestion:
ReplyDeleteWhere you surprised by the statistics about hate crimes in New York City? I find it interesting that there is such a backlash to the LGBt movement, in turns of violence and hatred. I can understand the backlash to an extent, but so often the line is crossed. How have your opinions on the matter, the stuff we have talked about in class and this module, changed, if any, since we have talked about it, and since you have entered college? College being the great refiner of our beliefs, some of which are temporary, but others more permanent and juts needed development.
I thought that the movement toward LGBT rights was moving along a lot faster than it actually is. After this module, I have definitely realized that we'll need to take leaps and bounds in our laws to create an equal living experience for LGBT people.
DeleteQuestion: Before reading the epigenetics article, where did you think homosexuality stemmed from? Nature vs. nurture, or something else entirely?
ReplyDeleteI've always thought, (especially since attending college), that homosexuality was something people are born with, just as I was born attracted to males, but I definitely didn't know how or why it happened. I thought this was a very interesting article!
DeleteMe too, Sabrina! It is very interesting
DeleteSame. I never really thought that there could be research behind it. I thought it was how you were born. I can understand why so many gays and lesbians are against this research though, almost as if that if they can find the answer to why someone is gay biologically, then they can be on the way to finding a "cure" for it.
DeleteI always thought it was solely nature (DNA). I remember in Sunday School once, someone insisted that even if homosexuals were born gay, they could take hormones or something and be cured...
DeleteIf I'd have had more of a backbone then, I would'a rolled my eyes and said something...
Comment: There is truly a misconception towards not only homosexuality but human sexuality as well; it's not just a black-and-white thing like "straight" or "gay" but an entire spectrum of sexual orientation. And I am so glad that we are talking about ways to bring these ideas to our kids, because no one should ever feel like killing themselves because of their sexuality (30-40% of LGBTQ youth have attempted suicide).
ReplyDeleteIt is interesting the context and stigmas attached to this issue. I do believe it is a black and white thing. Ultimately, I will care for my students regardless of anything. I want to be someone that is trusted and respected, because when I establish a relationship, it helps them and it helps me. I feel like this discussion will turn into a sin fest, when the responsibility for us as teachers is pretty significant. Teach what you want to teach, and you can see if it is effective and good and wholesome. Nonetheless, I do feel that I am probably outnumbered in terms of my beliefs versus the rest of the class. Haha.
DeleteI agree with you, Chels. I don't think that human sexuality is as black and white as people would like to believe. Thinking in terms of black and white is extremely comfortable for the mind state. I feel like critical thinking occurs in the grey area. We, as teachers, should shed light on different perspectives of social issues in order to get students out of their mental comfort zone and foster their critical thinking.
DeleteBen, I need to tell you about how my host teacher handled a situation where a student presented something about her cousin being gay & how everyone in class took something away from it, regardless their stance. I get what you're saying though. I have duties as a teacher & I have to do what I have to do without pushing my own agenda. My personal beliefs still shape my views on this matter, but I try to keep an open mind & am open to hearing what kids have to say. I may not agree all the time, but I'm totally there to listen to them & to be there for them. But, at the end of the day, I believe that we should all be kind to one another regardless of one's sexual orientation. :)
DeleteThis like this make it very obvious how far our society has come and how far it has left to go. The fact that the measure of public acceptance is rising, and that more and more LGBTQ individuals are able to be honest about themselves is great. But the fact that people can still be so resistant is disturbing. It is interesting to think of this in the same context that we have been thinking of the other equality topics. Have you ever considered "straight privilege"? Or how certain people would think if you were completely honest with them about your personal life? As teachers it is our role to make sure all of our students are comfortable being who they are and that they are prepared to understand that will only slowly learn to deal with it.
ReplyDeleteThat is a great question, Dawson. I haven't ever considered straight privilege, but it is totally out there. I have a lot of lesbian friends and people can be so mean to them. It is not out of the ordinary to hear a slur being yelled (especially if alcohol is involved) directed at them and their sexuality. The fact that I don't have to worry about that on a daily basis is definitely a privilege in itself, and that is only one of many I am sure.
DeleteThat is an awesome way to look at it! It is the same thing as race, it is something you are born with. When reading the articles about homosexuality in the workplace and how in many it is not illegal to fire someone for being gay I couldn't help but think that, to me, that is exactly the same as firing someone for being black. It is a straight privilege to be able to go to work and talk about your weekend or home life without fear of being fired.
DeleteStraight privilege. That's interesting. We talked about that a little bit in class when discussing Peggy McIntosh's article. I think one of those straight privileges is never having to hide your feelings or waste mental energy on trying to remain in the closet in the workplace or to people who would not be so accepting of that sexual orientation.
DeleteThe most surprising piece of information I came across in any of the articles was the fact that hate crimes against LGBT's is on the rise in places such as New York or California. Those states are typically liberal areas; you'd think they'd be on par with homosexual rights and what not. With all we've been learning about racism in the U.S., I can't say that I'm surprised colored LGBT's have a higher chance of being attacked or harassed. It's a shame how so many people resort to violence whenever there are issues presented like this. All is usually does it breed more contempt.
ReplyDeleteNow, a lot of people have been asking the question: "how would you go about teaching homosexuality in your classroom?" and I guess, instead of typing out an answer to everybody's question, I'll answer it in my comment box. If I did teach about homosexuality in the classroom, I would not support it. That is, I would make it clear that I believe homosexuality is a sin or, in other words, wrong. I plan to take that route in a private Christian or Catholic school (the kind of schools I have a strong desire to teach in) but if I were in a public school I would probably just not talk about it or if there was a student who was struggling with their sexual identity, I would direct them to a counselor or I would have a private (but within my legal limits) conversation with them if they insisted on talking to me about it rather than anyone else. It bothered me significantly when that one lesbian teacher came in and said that homosexuality is not a sin so I went home and I read as many of the Biblical verses that I could on or related to homosexuality and I read as many statements by Biblical scholars that I could find. After reading them, my belief has not changed regarding homosexuality and I strongly disagree with that previous lesbian speaker who I am convinced, like so many other Christians in the world, has never studied the Bible in depth.
That being said, I have never been nor ever will be a supporter of violence or discrimination against LGBT people. Though I do try and distance myself from anyone who engages in sin willingly, it is written that Christians are to love everyone in the world regardless of who they are or what they do. I'll do my best to leave judgement in God's hands. I do have friends that are homosexual and who are respectable people and I especially do not like hurting anybody's feelings over these controversial issues. So I'm really, really sorry for anyone who got offended by these statements but I've been holding back my opinions in class for far too long and thinking critically does not mean I have to accept the left wing's thinking. Once again, I'm really sorry for anyone who got offended by this and I do find it sad when there is crimes of hatred committed against anyone on the earth.
I get that expressing your beliefs on LGBTQ in a private school setting might be okay from a legal perspective, compared to a public setting, but the likelihood of you having a student who identifies as gay, lesbian, or somewhere on the spectrum is probably the same. Meaning you'll probably have at least one. I would probably think twice about expressing it to your students though. If I were a 12-17 year old boy who was struggling with my sexual identity and my teacher basically told me that a a big part of who I was is wrong, then it's probably going to be seriously difficult to get me to learn from you. I found nothing you said to be particularly offensive, I just think topics like homosexuality, abortion, etc. are too divisive to come from a teacher in that way.
DeleteI went to a Catholic high school, and we were taught that homosexuality in and of itself is not a sin, premarital sex is. And since gays cannot marry in the church, any homosexual act is technically a sin. So, that would make me just as much of a sinner as you believe a gay person is. I agree with Will that some students may have a difficult time learning from you if I knew that was your opinion. However, I respect your views even if they differ from mine.
DeleteIt seems to me that admitting these views to a student who is struggling with his or her own identity would probably be one of the most harmful things you could ever do to a child. Not just educationally as Will and Chelsea pointed out. The children we will be interacting with are going to be extremely fragile mentally, and a condemnation such as this from a respected authority figure could easily spin out into depression or a host of other mental and emotional issues.
DeleteI think that one thing I have learned from this MAT program is that you should never tell someone that the way they are is wrong. People cannot change who they are and telling a vulnerable person, especially a child, that what they are doing is wrong could not only hinder their education, but could also lead to the high amount of suicide in the LGBT community. I think acceptance of your students is the first thing you must do to break through the barrier for them to actually learn something. I think, as teachers, we have to put our own ideals aside and accept kids for who they are before they will hear anything that we're trying to teach them, whether it be about academia or life.
DeleteI think that it is important to remember that Biblical scholars as well as ministers and other ordained holy people from virtually every denomination, all of whom have devoted their lives to Biblical study still do not agree on issues of homosexuality and the Bible. Many deeply religious Christians support gay rights. Also, many people who are "right wing" support gay marriage and there are people who are "left wing" who do not support it. George Bush Sr. was an official witness at the wedding of two same-sex friends just last week.
DeleteSo the Supreme Court overturned many important sections of DOMA recently, which I think means that homosexuals now have access to at least a great deal of the 1,138 rights that article was talking about. Does anyone know if all of those rights are now provided?
ReplyDeleteI felt that the epigenetics article was assuming (or at least presenting as a 'given') that an excess or deficiency in testosterone is the key factor in determining sexuality. The article only talks about how such an excess/deficiency would occur, without talking about whether or not this imbalance would actually cause the effect claimed.
Is there other research I am missing which provides the missing link between too much testosterone and lesbianism?
Why does our culture react the way it does? How can one thing (like homosexuality) go from being taboo to being trendy to being more or less acceptable? Does it start/end with teachers? Do we have that much of an impact?
ReplyDeleteYes. I think we do have that much of an impact. These kids come to school from all walks of life and we as teachers have to show that we are there for them no matter what their background is. If we show that we care about each individual child they will be more open to us as adults they can trust. I think its our job (at our schools at least) to promote a safe and accepting environment. A no tolerance place for bullying. If we can make our kids see that judging others for things that is beyond their control is wrong then I think they will carry that with them when they leave us.
DeleteI think also the media has a HUGE impact on what our society thinks is trendy and teachers are the only ones that can really break through to kids about what goes on in the news (and try not push our own agendas.)
DeleteThe information I found most interesting dealt with the benefits that married couples receive which same-sex couples don't. Whenever the issue of gay marriage arises, I always just think about love as being the reason why they would want to be married (which I think is a really good reason). I often don't take into account the practical reasons. I think it's terrible that same-sex couples don't get many tax benefits, cannot get care under FMLA, and are excluded from several Social Security benefits. These are just some examples that baffle me and I simply can't wrap my head around.
ReplyDeleteThe article that really stuck out to me was the one that talked about the benefits LGBTQ's don't get because their relationship isn't acknowledged by the Federal Government. Who the hell cares what the government says about relationships? Thats not what they should be worried about. Hello! Our government just shut the hell down. Obviously they don't have their shit together. It pisses me off to no end that people are judged and harassed and bullied and even killed because of their sexual orientation. Its hard enough as it is to find love in this crazy world. Why should people who find it be denied it? And its not just about love. If there is a Lesbian couple that has been together for 40 years they should have the same rights as a heterosexual couple who married when they were 19 and then realized they were too young to even be in a marriage. I think these days marriage isn't taken as seriously as it should be. Its not playing house...It is a commitment. It is the union of two people that are committing their lives to each other. They are going to be there for each other and take care of each other no matter what. The benefits given to married couples are necessary for lots of reasons...if one gets sick and needs someone to make decisions on their behalf...if there is a child involved and so on. It PISSES me off that not everyone is given these rights especially when a couple has been together for years and they are treated as if they don't even know each other by our government. UGH this module really got me fired up.
ReplyDeleteDear Chelsea, I love you.
Deletejojo
Dear Jo Jo, I love you more.
DeleteChelsea
Preach. Anger is the right word. Honestly, with all of the positive media attention and the wide representation of the LGBTQ community on TV, I thought that our nation had gotten better. I thought that it really does get better for this sadly marginalized group of people, but the statistics, the hate crimes, the politics of the workplace, and our own government says otherwise. I'm with you, Chelsea. We're both a little angrier I guess.
Deleteyou are very fiery and i love it.
DeleteMy question is, Why is this an issue? Is it just because people are afraid of what they don't understand? Is it because of religion? Why is it so hard for people to just accept others for who they are?
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DeleteI don't know Chels it makes me sad :( We are all humans and we should all love each other as humans, regardless of race, sex, sexual orientation, or religious preference. End of story. In my own life, I try to be as Christ-like as a possibly can, so I love everyone and so should you *Uncle Sam poster*
DeleteI think that it can be a combination of all those things, Chelsea. I think that a lot of it comes from the fact that people are uninformed about the LGBTQ community and they absolutely fear what they don't understand. I think that increasing the facts that people know about this is the key to promoting understanding and acceptance. Now, whether or not this is our duty as teachers is a different issue. I think that it is our duty to make sure that students aren't discriminated against for ANY reason whether it be their race, their sexuality, or their mental capabilities. Perhaps creating a classroom setting where abuse or bullying isn't tolerated in any form, and teaching students to accept their peers is enough to give them a push in a positive direction without having to explicitly teach homosexuality in our lessons is a step in the right direction.
DeleteChelsea W- And if we can't love each other for those reasons, for some crazy reason, we should at least be able to respect each other as a humans!
DeleteA part of the job discrimination that wasn't brought up in the article was the fact that someone could be fired "for poor work" even though, in reality, the boss had an issue with their employ being gay. EG. Jojo does his job well, is out at work and everyone likes him. BUT because he’s gay, his boss cooks up some charges and writes them up documenting how Jojo isn’t doing his job as well. "didn't turn report x in in a timely manor" - It was turned in before the deadline, but not early etc.
ReplyDeleteSO, gay workers have even less margin for error than their straight counterparts. This leades to more work related stress, relationship problems. etc
Even when ENDA is passed (Employment Non-Discrimination Act), LGBT folks will still not be guaranteed equal treatment int eh workplace.
I thought about the fact that an employer may make up "valid reasons" for firing a gay employee to cover up the fact that he is discriminating someone based solely on their sexual orientation. However, I did not consider the idea that an LGBTQ employee must be extremely careful about their work ethic and job performance to lessen the chance of being fired for errors. LGBTQ people have to be so conscious in the workplace as opposed to their straight coworkers.
DeleteSo violence is rising against LGBTQ people, or maybe it's just being reported more because victims feel more bolder and come front. But, here's my question: Is a crime more of a bad thing when it's motivated by race, gender, sexual orientation? I'm never sure how i feel about Hate Crimes legislation, and I'm probably the only gay person you know who says this. Everyone points to Matthew Sheppard.
ReplyDeleteBut Is it really worse to kill someone for being gay than to kill someone? Isn't a murder a murder? I firmly believe that premeditated murder should be held much much higher than accidentally killing someone (in a car wreck etc) . Aren't Hate Crimes laws just saying that “o, so you killed bobby in cold blood cause he took your parking place, but it’s so much worse that you killed gay jojo cause you don’t like that he’s gay?”
Thoughts?
I think I agree with what you're saying... but it feels weird to say because there's something innately wrong with saying I'm against Hate Crimes legislation haha. But I agree that murder is murder. I think the reason that they are in place though is so that people who do want to murder someone just for being gay maybe they will be discouraged? But that's like you're assuming that criminals follow the law... I've never thought about this. Very interesting point, Jojo.
DeleteI am very much opposed to hate crime legislation, as I believe that it punishes thought. Granted motive comes from looking at what the offender was doing and why he did it, but saying that a person needs more time in jail because they killed somebody because they were in a minority, does not sit well with me. Hate Crime legislation does not need to end, if it is going to remain, at just certain groups, but it should extend to everything and everybody. The state and the government have no right to know what I am thinking when I don't want them to know. The greatest right we have is the right to be left alone, and hate crime legislation is a slippery slope to worse legislation about what is acceptable to think. I may sound crazy, but it is entirely plausible.
DeleteI've never really thought about hate-crime legislation like that before, Jojo, so I don't have a carefully considered opinion to offer on that front. All I know is that hate crimes personally scare me more than most other kinds of crime.
DeleteIt may be a strange thing to admit, but I can understand most criminal motives. I don't agree or sympathize with criminals, but for most of them I can understand why they did it on an intellectual level.
I cannot do this for two kinds of motive, hate crimes, and crimes perpetuated by the mentally ill (e.g. psychotics).
I just can't wrap my head around what seems to be the basic tenant of a hate-crime. "You are so far beneath me that it does not matter what I do to you. I can beat you, rob you, and kill you, and those actions will be justified by the nature of your existence."
The idea that someone can think like this scares me WAY more than things like gang violence.
I am mad at myself for not remembering to bring the handout to class "The Bible and Homosexuality" because some of you are clearly interested in the religious roots of this debate. Unfortunately, it isn't a document I have on my computer here in Athens. Help me remember to bring it next week.
ReplyDeleteI really want to read this!
DeleteI'm curious about this too, Dr. Alby. I'd love to read it.
DeleteSame here! I would love to read it too!
DeleteI do highly recommend listening to the "On Being" podcast episode called "Gay Marriage: Broken or Blessed?" The first half features a Christian who is struggling, in a very deep and meaningful way, with how he should feel about gay marriage. He is torn and he speaks very eloquently about being unsure how to feel.
ReplyDeleteWhen I was in high school, we learned about a gay male who was brutally murdered for his sexuality... (I believe it was in Alabama and its driving me nuts that I cant remember his name. It was a pretty famous case though, so maybe someone else will know) Anyway, the story struck me immediately and was extremely upsetting... My first year in college, I heard that his mother was going to speak at my school. of course, I went to hear her speak and it was heartbreaking. So many dont realize that their actions destroy REAL lives... All of this LBGTQ stuff just reminded me of that and I thought id share..
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